Maybe this would be a push for a real open source based phone. GNU/Linux phones needed this push to really get more popularity
Not if age verification apps have any say.
https://github.com/eu-digital-identity-wallet/av-doc-technical-specification/issues/18
You can’t sideload on Linux.
…because why "sideload"when frontload works directly? I guess…maybe it’s your cuckold fetish to watch someone else nerd your box…
Don’t even try to get me started on windoze until the fucking Epstein files are releeased.
I hope this means the resurgence of cheap flip phones. I have no use for a pocket computer that I can’t use like a computer. I went with Android because iOS was useless, and now Android is about to be made equally useless.
Will be interesting to see how many people move over to iOS now that Google is trashing Android’s redeeming feature.
I’ve enabled the advanced protection and it’s so easy to turn off to install a single app and turn back on but I haven’t seen it as an issue. Is there something new now? Because I’m not seeing an issue here.
Yes they are, for all intents and purposes, making it impossible to turn off advanced protection. The only way to install unverified apps will be via developer mode and if you turn that on a bunch of apps refuse to run until you turn it back off
Can’t you just switch off Play Protect entirely?
The only way to install unverified apps will be via developer mode and if you turn that on a bunch of apps refuse to run until you turn it back off.
Wait, when did this become a thing? I’ve had developer mode turned on on my phone for ages without any issues.
Not sure when exactly but some banking apps in the UK refuse to run if they detect developer mode is enabled and, given the general trend towards locking everything down, I expect many other mainstream apps to enforce these checks at some point.
I guess one could run two phones, an official phone for banking etc and another one with dev mode for pissing around but these rules will reduce the number of people who install unverified apps to a very small number
Well fuck that then. I guess I’m going to have to get a graphene OS put on this mother fucker.
That’s really too bad because I did appreciate all the other features of advanced protection except for that.
Presumably, rooted users/custom ROMs should be able to get around this, but how many developers are going to continue to support development and/or release .apk files if it’s only a tiny subset of the userbase they can reach?
We kind of need the Linux Foundation or Fairphone or similar to fork android or create a solid base for an alternative. Otherwise, we are screwed.
I don’t see that happening since the Linux foundation gets a bunch of funding from Google
Yes, but Google is probably happy to host their whole datacenter infrastructure on Linux and won’t have to buy expensive Windows server licenses and wants to keep it this way.
Windows can’t remotely keep up with Linux or even BSD
Ah yes, let’s host a website on IIS
Wtf? So Google has basically “bought” the only competitor that isn’t big tech
The Linux foundation isn’t a competitor at all. It gets all of its funding from big tech
They don’t develop something unless it is useful to these companies.
They don’t develop something unless it is useful to these companies.
they fund development for the servo browser. who is that useful for as of now?
I don’t think the Linux foundation is doing any development themselves. Linux is open source, so anyone can contribute. I think the Linux foundation is like a legal entity and marketing kinda thing. I could be wrong about this though.
The individual members of the foundation most certainly do linux dev, which benefits their specific company. Think kernel or driver adjustments or supporting newer hardware for servers/datacenters.
However, that doesnt mean its only the foundation doing the work, thats just the paid work being done. The rest is all passion projects of people
Fairphone is already collaborating with a fork, /e/OS
Like lineoageOS?
AFAIK, LineageOS is not a fork but a version of Android that is built on top of the Android Open Source Project (AOSP).
Yeah we’re boned, Everything we have Android like is AOSP based and as the changes happen, keeping them at bay will become unsustainable. Lineage, Graphine and Calyx are all AOSP based.
For now, it will likely be pretty easy for any of the forks to circumvent this particular change. I’m more worried about the future, it wouldn’t be hard for them to start pushing store APK’s to require proprietary hooks, there’s a good chance that eventually people won’t want to keep around Google and non Google versions of apps.
So you have Halium+VM for ~ ubuntu touch (still android drivers, but private)
Or postmarket derivatives, which is real linux, but is barely functional and has miserable battery life.
We’re playing catch up for linux and we can get there, but available phones are super limited and none of the contenders are solid daily drivers yet.
Biggest problem I have is there’s no good way to run Signal. If you do it in Halium under waydroid it eats power and getting it to run/keeping it updated under arm/linux is a part time job.
Luckily this shit (Google Play Protect) is in Google Play Services not AOSP.
The actual big change coming to AOSP is that development is going to start happening behind closed doors. You get the updated code when the new version is released, instead of seeing commits as they appear on the master branch. This might make it harder for the custom ROMs to keep up at all.
I’m more worried about the future, it wouldn’t be hard for them to start pushing store APK’s to require proprietary hooks, there’s a good chance that eventually people won’t want to keep around Google and non Google versions of apps.
If this results in a noticeable decrease in apps available on 3rd party stores, this might be cause for some nice EU action, like they did with Apple. But I’m not too hopeful.
I imagine it would be the likes of Graphene, Lineage, Calyx, and some others at the core. Probably some hardware vendors like Fairphone, Shiftphone, and probably a Xiaomi or Huawei.
Edit: ROMs maintain their own code base, but I’m pretty sure OP was talking about a larger fork of AOSP. That’s what I’ve suggested recently, anyway.
LineageOS has a great offering but you have to wait until your phone gets outdated because even hoping that it’ll be compatible with your model
No you dont. Lineageos supports a lot of phones that are still supported by their manufactures. Hell my fp4 is still in support too, and lineageos runs fine on it :p
Youre thinking of unofficial lineageos builds and ports to non-supported-by-lineageos phones
The EU would like you all to bend a little lower and gag
https://github.com/eu-digital-identity-wallet/av-doc-technical-specification/issues/18
I have my Pixel 9 pro with GrapheneOS. Google ain’t telling me shit about what I can or can’t install.
Are the banking apps still blocked? How’s the camera? It’s been a while since I installed grapheneos…
I use a credit union, and they whitelisted the OS about a week after I told them about it.
The camera is really good.
Are the banking apps still blocked?
Depends on the app.
You can just install Googles Camera without Gservices if you want
N26, revolut, and google wallet didn’t work when I was using it a few years ago.
Wallet told me it’s not supported on “rooted devices” (official grapheneos doesn’t allow root and is actually even more secure than google’s regular OS) and Revolut was buggy and didn’t let me sign in a few weeks ago
Revolut explicitly blocks anything not blessed by Google IIRC. One of the worst things about them, it’s otherwise a pretty convenient app.
I recently did graphene on a new pixel. My bank app (Chase, in the US) did not work immediately but did after lifting Graphene’s default app restrictions, strictly for that one app.
Namely “exploit protection compatibility mode” being enabled did the trick.
Camera on the 9a is fine, but I’m not a photographer. I take photos of serial numbers and server rooms. /Shrug
Pixels are made by Google? You’re supporting this hot mess? They can lock the bootloader any time?
I locked the bootloader back after installing GrapheneOS. You have to have physical access to the device to do that.
What I mean, with future os updates people might lose the ability the unlock it in the first place. You are safe as long you don’t update to newer pixel android versions. This is what happens to me now if I upgrade my Samsung above oneui8. I will lose the ability to unlock it, forfeiting things like lineageos in the future.
The Pixel 10 just launched, and the bootloader is still unlockable.
If they lock down the bootloader, I’ll just follow wherever the GrapheneOS crew takes their project.
If it becomes impossible for them to continue, I’ll probably just start using a dumb phone and carrying a small netbook with Linux for my internet needs.
Non-zero chance that the GrapheneOS crew will work with a manufacturer to bring a phone to market if Pixels get fully locked down.
Pixel’s predecessor itself, Nexus, was a somewhat low production volume (compared to Samsung or Apple at least) phone for enthusiasts, that Google partnered with different manufacturers to design and produce.
I mean, this is terrible garbage, but if Google is going to fully ruin Android then at least the news being out might push resources towards mobile Linux faster.
I’m actually using an old iphone. I look at it like an appliance to connect with mainstream institutions (including local people like other school parents), and take pictures. I have other appliances of varying complexity up to and including my car that run systems I know nothing about as well. I’m not happy about that either, but these are the compromises that happen in the real world.
The closed system isn’t appealing to me, but the mass market appeal of the device is. A stunning majority of my direct acquaintances use it. It can streamline interactions sometimes.
And you know, I don’t trust them of course, but at least Apple has actually said out loud in high profile presentations that privacy is a fundamental human right, and they always point out when they can keep personal things on-device. And they fight orders to unlock phones. Plus they make their money on hardware sales and services for the most part.
Google, on the other hand, exists pretty much solely to vacuum up data and keep us online and cloud-connected. They typically get major points for interoperability from me, but then I ask how often is it just a cynical embrace/extend/extinguish strategy?
Any big mainstream phone now is just a locked down disposable product of a megacorp. It’s also a data scraping tendril of said megacorp loaded with sensors and a fast data connection. And now as a bonus for those of us in the US - it’s probably a convenient backdoor warrantless wiretap that the oligarchs can just accidentally forward the government the passwords to.
My COMPUTER runs Linux. I can’t wait until I can have a real linux computer in the form factor of a high quality phone.
I have an old phone how would I install Linux and still use it as a phone, for texting etc?
Look at postmarket OS. Unless you are really lucky, texting, calling, wifi, etc is not or barely working.
Unfortunately it isn’t as simple as just needing the right Linux distro with a touch-friendly “DE.”
We essentially need the “IBM compatible” equivalent phone platform like how modern PCs got started.
Build up graphene and Linux phones!
GrapheneOS is probably not long for this world with how much Google has been fucking with AOSP’s source code releases. We need full-fat mainline Linux on our phones, with no Android code included.
Lineage OS works for me
it is not secure for modern threat models… even of basic normie. unlocked bootloader with ice around is unacceptable.
Bootloader is for defence against Evil Maid, and Afaik, ICE is just gonna snatch you, not do a “Evil Maid” attack, so just get it rebooted before you get taken and they shouldn’t even be able to decrypt it since its BFU. (You’ll need a long password/passphrase tho since PIN Limits can be bypassed because bootloader is unlocked)
Edit: Also reboot your phone before going to sleep in case you get raided midnight.
Can you explain why? Does your threat model involve nation state actors compromising your phone physically?
The core problem isnt nation state actors. Could just be your local police department searching your phone with tools built by those nation-state actors. Cellebrite documentation gets leaked from time to time, and iOS is safe if it’s off and gos is safe with default settings, everything else is breakable.
And that is local podunk cop who just takes a interest hooking up your phone to a cracking tool…
Now every police contact becomes a opportunity to leak all of your digital life
- traffic stops
- DUI checkpoints
- boarder crossings
- witnessing a crime (phone is now evidence)
- protests
- contempt of cop, etc
Sounds like I’ll be using a “phone” with Ubuntu Touch or similar with a VoIP SIP app running. As long as I have 4G/5G data, that’ll probably work as well as anything I’m willing to use.
For me, this has the added bonus of being able to configure my VoIP service however I want. Mine lets me do custom menus and such, easier to filter out robots that way.
Let’s see if I have an old Pixel 3a around…
Is it offering SMS? I ported to jmp.chat recently, using their XMPP gateway for voice and SMS. They offer a VOIP option, but don’t support SMS.
I like being able to SMS, and I guess call, from my laptop. But there aren’t any Linux XMPP clients that I’m particularly happy with, so I’m just using Cheogram in Waydroid. It’s not exactly optimal.
I’m using VoIP.ms and yeah, they do SMS and MMS ($0.0075 per SMS, $0.02 per MMS). They have both an online portal and an Android app. There are a few limitations, but it seems to work pretty well overall.
They need more donations and bug reports!
Ubuntu touch works on pixel 3s. It was incredibly easy to install. I set aside an afternoon to make it work, and I was done in line 15 minutes. I was shocked. It has some rough edges but its usable. The biggest issue is the lack of apps. Also, i couldnt figure out the sandboxing thing that lets you run any limux app. I think maybe the UI had some bugs or something, it wasnt very intuitive.
It’s running on Halium, it’s still an Android core and drivers. It is at least private.
Running android apps destoys the battery and the linux apps available are scant. But it’s honestly probably the best thing we have.
Lol this is old news brah 😅
Still waiting my Moto G 5G 2024 to have the “Allow OEM Unlocking” option to become un-greyed… it’s currently day 2/7 I think?
(supposedly it takes 7 days after being connected to the internet, even tho I already got the unlock code… 🤷♂️)
Would you mind letting me know if it works out? Was thinking of getting a Moto G, I’m using an elderly Samsung and no way will I replace it with another Samsung.
YAYAYAYAY! 😁 (Today is Day 6, didn’t even need the full 7 days)
I feel like a Hacker right now.
Now I just need to flash Lineage.
Good luck, my friend. Moto G 2024 is only like $140 (on discount) right now. Do not get carrier versions, those don’t unlock. Get the full retail price version. Its XT2417-1.
Great news! Congrats mate, and thanks for updating me.
I’m not sure if the same issues are present in the phone you guys are referring to but I had a terrible experience with a G35. More here https://samartean-rares.com/moto-g35-terrible-software-decent-hardware-117 . Idk use your own judgement ofc but perhaps be wary that what you buy won’t be hot garbage. That G35 that I had truly was hot garbage, but it’s an entry level phone I guess.
Thanks for the heads up. Yeah it’s hard to know what’s going to be a pile of shit. I had a good experience with a moto previously - but that was maybe ten years ago, a lot could have changed since then.
I’m looking for something mid range I guess, £500 max. I’ve always had cheaper phones and I’m tired of being frustrated with a device I use so much so I’m gonna spend a bit more on the next one.
Good luck. Can’t really advise as i never had a phone that expensive but maybe consider one that is compatible with a more private OS like GrapheneOS.
My last phone was Moto G 5G and it got destroyed…
Did you drop it, or are you saying its motorola’s fault?
So what happened is the dumbest thing ever. Yes it did have a small Crack on the screen… but that didn’t do anything for months until it rained and then ONE drop landed on a spot that busted it. No joke. It seemed to return to life a long ass time later but the screen still died and is non functional.
I mean a “small crack” is a big deal tho. Even if it was a pixel, that “small crack” would’ve ruing the IP rating.
But unlike a $500 pixel, the Moto G 5G 2024 only $140 so you could just easily get a replacement.
Maybe I will buy another one once my current phone is paid off… which will be next summer!
Still sucks for the OSS community as a whole though.
Didn’t Google just fuck with them by making it really hard to developed graphene for pixel 10? If graphene os depends on the aging fleet of pixel 9s and older, they’re a few years away from being screwed too.
Yeah sort of. I think they’re working with an OEM so they do get security patches early, but yeah. They stopped publishing the reference device tree or something and now it’s harder to support new pixels AFAIK. Yes. I imagine graphene is going to try to switch to a new OEM phone they can have more control over, but we’ll see. Really sucks and fuck google. They’re just trying to lock android down like apple to ensure they get a % of all profits. (IMO)
Cans and string are about to make a comeback?
Meshtastic lol.
Or ham radios, or use a bright light to send morse code (using on/off flashes)
Use One Time Pad to encrypt the text.
Well, I never gave them permission to install Google Chrome. Maybe they should start thinking about their self first…
Ive had grapheneOS for years, is every customer android rom done for? I may just get a “dumbphone” or maybe back to iphone? I wish I could just have no phone but obviously need close family to contact me at anytime
It’s very strange that you are considering moving to a dumbphone or an even more locked-down platform because google is locking down android.
They’re taking away a vital feature, so you want even more taken away?
What would you recommend? Apple tracks a ton of data but also blocks 3rd party trackers at least
I would recommend staying away from apple if control over your device is something you value.
Linux phones
Your™
Us: nope, I degoogled my Android phone. Good luck.
MicroG is amazing
